Growing Through Grief & Intuition

Join Shelby & Khara as they navigate the powerful energy of eclipse season and unpack the magic of synchronicities. Through personal stories, they reveal how journaling shines a light on our emotions and the recurring cycles that shape our lives.

Khara opens up about her experience with miscarrying for the second time and the profound lessons of self-care it taught her. Allowing emotions to flow rather than suppressing them has been essential for her healing process. By prioritizing rest over relentless productivity, Khara has begun to find balance and clarity amid discomfort, embracing personal growth and the transformative power of vulnerability.

Shelby explores the fascinating intersection of physical pain and emotional experiences through the lens of German New Medicine. Chronic tooth pain becomes a metaphor for unacknowledged needs and suppressed self-worth. As Shelby ponders her own value and self-worth, she uses meditation to discover the magic within and emerges as a new version of herself.

Through meditation and synchronicities, they reconnect with their inner boldness, ready to embrace new beginnings with courage and confidence.

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Transcript

Shelby Wagner:

0:02

Looking for Evidence is hosted by Khara Collins and myself, Shelby Wagner. We're two Voxer besties who were brought together via our fascination with human design. We use tools like astrology, enneagram or human design to better understand ourselves and tackle everyday challenges, and we love talking about it. So come on in, let the insights begin. Well, hello Khara, how are you?

Khara Collins:

0:29

Good, a little sleepy. I'm going to blame it on eclipse vibes. What about you?

Shelby Wagner:

0:35

Oh yeah, I'm like the same and you know I feel like I've said this a lot, but this in between the eclipse situation is really wild, really uprooting, and I feel like with every eclipse or some kind of like major thing that I go into and I'm like I don't know, I feel like I've gotten everything out. I've kind of let go everything. The next thing is like oh no, wait, there's more.

Khara Collins:

1:04

Yes, I'm finding the same kind of thing I was just looking back on like stuff from a year ago and a whole journal entry about the same things I'm reflecting on now and I'm like, okay, I guess it's not over, because I feel like I'm still integrating all this.

Shelby Wagner:

1:20

Yeah, yeah. So coming up a little bit of a tired rest phase, a little emotional hangover perhaps, and very excited for new moon vibes and the eclipse to maybe close a few things out this week.

Khara Collins:

1:36

Yes, just a neat little bow hopefully.

Shelby Wagner:

1:40

Yeah, neat little bow, like it usually goes. Well, what's you know what's cooking in your world?

Khara Collins:

1:48

Well, with this eclipse, I've been looking back on, you know, like the last year and like the last six months, to see like what themes have been coming up, and I know we've talked on Voxer about it, but it's just a lot on boundaries, a lot on like emotional regulation and just you know the the signs be signing and the sinks be sinking.

Shelby Wagner:

2:20

I want a t-shirt, it's so true. It was like the season of synchronicities. I, you know, was even just doing I don't know if it was just a Instagram post or something the other day, but just talking about like I just I see the signs all the time and I'm like I don't know if it's real or not, but I feel like it's a way to live life and I feel like it's a good one.

Khara Collins:

2:41

So yeah, definitely. It's like if it's helping you, who cares?

Shelby Wagner:

2:48

If you need to see the syncs, that's fine. Well, do you got some stories about synchronicities or things that are coming up in your world?

Khara Collins:

3:01

It's just kind of like a heavier topic that's been coming up a lot around, like loss and just those feelings kind of coming up again and actually it's funny like they came up for me before I realized like what they were and then, looking back into the journal entries, I'm kind of like rediscovering like oh yeah, this is to the day when this happened, like, and it's just funny how you know, the body always knows and got to get out of the mind sometimes and feel into the body and see, you know, what might be left over from some situations that you thought you were over or, you know, worked through.

Shelby Wagner:

3:39

Yeah, yeah, and that phrase you said they came up before. I realized you know the body remembers and you know, and also how lucky we are for those of us who journal in some capacity or keep track in some capacity of of life events, of emotions, because they also are clues, because sometimes you know, we just know something's off, or we know we're feeling heavy and we don't really quite remember or know why. And I feel like I'm moving through something similar too and we'll talk I'll talk about that later, but I think it's. It feels like a vibe out in the ether right now about the uh, the body remembering and to how to access what it is remembering and to try to help it process what it's trying, what it's trying to get out yeah, and it feels kind of extreme too.

Khara Collins:

4:37

just coming off the birthday high, you know, at the end of august, and I was just feeling like just euphoric, a lot like just and just kind of like accepting that feeling and really appreciating it, and then, towards you know, the end of September now I started having this like sadness and like just I don't know really feeling off like completely opposite of euphoria.

Khara Collins:

5:04

And I remember, like on Voxer I think I was telling you like oh man, I don't know why I'm feeling like this, like it's just, all of a sudden I'm just feeling this sadness. And looking back at my journal, it was like I think it was like the 25th was the day and I had an entry on the 28th about a miscarriage that I had, and just looking back at that and kind of remembering everything but then just figuring out that it was the exact day that I was like noticing these feelings and like the days leading up to it. It's just wild to like I'm glad I have this journal entry to like remind me and like remember, like my feelings and just know that it's not like a random coincidence that I feel like this.

Shelby Wagner:

5:54

Yeah. Is there anything that you feel like looking back on it, on your entry around that time and sorry for that, that loss that you experienced? Do you feel like you noticed anything new about how you moved through that time or how that time has contributed to the cycle of you know of life that you're in in this moment? As you look back at that?

Khara Collins:

6:21

Yeah, I actually like, wanted to read the entry and talk about that because it's like same kind of themes right now, but okay, so this was from um September 28th of last year, 2023, and I'm just gonna get into it. Um, I find a lot of times I mask my sadness with anger. I think it's some kind of defense mechanism, like anger somehow relates to being strong and letting myself cry will be viewed as weak. The truth is, when I finally do cry, I feel like my tears are even more powerful than my anger, because they are accumulation of my emotions over time. It's like a dam breaking or something. Accumulation of my emotions over time. It's like a dam breaking or something.

Khara Collins:

7:08

This week, I miscarried for the second time. The first time was right before I quit my oil and gas career nearly two years ago. I'm not sure if I gave myself enough time to grieve, but it also felt like it was barely beginning. This time was different. Everything was there multiple tests for weeks positive and then, right at six weeks this past Monday, I had a sharp pain for a few hours and then started bleeding. I went to the ER and they brought in an emergency sonographer and they couldn't see anything. They checked my blood and after an agonizing three days, I found out that I was at the five to six week mark. I had more blood taken today and my midwife had the results expedited so I could put my mind at ease and I found out they dropped significantly.

Khara Collins:

7:50

I didn't think I would be as devastated as I am, but I'm letting myself because I know I need to let it out. I can't keep suppressing my anger and sadness. I have to express it. I know I will be pregnant again at the right time and it just feels really shitty right now and I'm just letting that be the case. So often I find myself in fix-it mode, either for myself or the vibe around me, and I'm realizing how problematic that is. Reading and maintaining the vibe once served me, but it no longer does, and it's such a difficult behavior to change after it's done such a good job of protecting me. But it's time for me to lay it down and let it be what it is. Yeah, so that was that entry and I actually this is I had another entry like a few days later. That was like kind of the aftermath of it and it's kind of short, but I feel like I want to read that also because it was like the process of what I did, kind of. This was on October 4th of 2023, like almost exact eclipse day. Like in the clips, this year is on the second, so it says I feel much better. I asked for what I needed last week from work and Philip, from work and Philip and got it, and then I took a couple of days off on top of a week from working home so I could properly grieve and feel my feelings. It was uncomfortable but worth it, and I feel so much better after giving myself that time.

Khara Collins:

9:19

I'm learning so much lately about myself and my needs and desires and where they come from and what I'm lacking in terms of emotional regulation. I feel like I have a real opportunity to find balance in my life, and it is extraordinarily uncomfortable. After swinging from one extreme to the next in all areas of my life, I find myself questioning my actions and if I'm doing enough. Instead of blowing through that feeling, I've given myself space to consider why I'm feeling like that and what I'm finding is that I have placed so much value on staying busy and being productive that I don't even consider or give myself credit for the immense value I'm able to create or bring to what I'm doing so easily. I discount that it being easy means that it's not valuable as something that takes a long time or is difficult.

Khara Collins:

10:06

There are many things I do naturally and effortlessly that have tremendous value, and it feels really good to let that be the case and not beat myself up when I'm not working every waking minute.

Khara Collins:

10:18

It's an adjustment, going from overworking and extreme burnout to allowing myself to complete my work and sit in the discomfort of rest instead of filling my time with more things. I'm finding that the space I give myself at work brings more clarity and allows for some things to work themselves out before I even get to them. Letting them breathe allows me to breathe. So, yeah, it's very, very timely and like on brand and on theme for everything I'm feeling right now the balance, the you know need for rest and space week for me, just being pissed off because I've been filling my time instead of, like you know, blocking off space for me to just like have time alone or do things that like fill my cup. And it's still kind of a new thing for me to integrate, like I have been working on it since last year and before then too, but it's still like a daily practice and something I have to be mindful of because it's really easy to get swept away and like just the day-to-day everything and everybody else's like needs, you know.

Shelby Wagner:

11:36

Yeah, well, it's such a great point to I think the fact that, like, just because we have awareness of something doesn't mean it just gets resolved in the moment, right and so to know.

Shelby Wagner:

11:49

I think sometimes you can look back and go, wow, I'm still talking about this, this same thing or the same challenge, and think, like it's been a year, it's been two years, how am I still here? But also noticing those small ways in which you have made progress right. So it's, it's both. It's both long and short, it's both. There's still more to go, but I've also been productive. It's. It's like that, that balance of the two things happening at once.

Khara Collins:

12:19

Yeah, and just like also just asking for what I need.

Khara Collins:

12:23

That's been a real like new beginning for me, really like to be vocal about my needs and not wait until it blows up or goes to some extreme where it's just like I can't even ask, like it's just not a big milestone for me to be able to just not feel guilty about asking for time off and like taking extra time on top of the time I was already given, because you know it was like a big loss for me and I was really appreciative at the time like I was, I was working for the city and they were really supportive of that Like making sure they checked in on me and like gave me extra time if I needed it and it was that part was so healing to have and to just like not have to like fight for it.

Khara Collins:

13:17

You know Right. And then you know even now like I haven't necessarily had like losses come up, but like just other situations where I've been uncomfortable or had a feeling that I hadn't brought up to somebody and being brave and like bringing that up. And you know, when I bring it up it's not as big of a deal as I've made it in my head. So it's like kind of this reoccurring theme of like boundaries and like vocalizing my needs and, you know, just speaking up instead of just like people pleasing and, you know, suppressing emotions and pushing through. You know, like I've done my whole life basically.

Shelby Wagner:

13:56

Yeah, but I thought and I also think there's been a the gift side of of that is you recognizing that it always doesn't have to feel so hard, easy, right, or it can be easy, um, once you do speak up like, oh, you know, if I have the, you know the right people in my life, like they'll lean in and want to know how they can adjust, or you know to set those boundaries and if you need more time for yourself, if you have the right people surrounding you, like they're going to say, of course you know. So also like growing in that way that it isn't always this major like friction to ask for what you need, that people are often willing to help and accommodate.

Khara Collins:

14:41

Yes, and that's been like a theme over the last like I don't know. Obviously I've been working on it for a long time, but especially this last month I feel like I've really been recognizing how good it is and how good I'm feeling, and even that is uncomfortable at times because I'm so used to being like so busy and like annoyed or like frustrated that I don't have more time for things that I want to do. Like it's a whole new experience to just like get used to feeling good so often and like so much, you know it sounds crazy.

Khara Collins:

15:16

but it's like you get addicted to this, like anxiety and like searching for problems and talking about problems, and it's like, okay, there's always going to be problems, but there's also a lot of really good things happening and they need to be appreciated too. So just like allowing myself to have that and to like really appreciate how far I've come and just sit with that and reflect back on that and just, you know, kind of let myself be proud of myself because it's pretty difficult's pretty difficult.

Shelby Wagner:

15:46

It's like I'm not like a little kid I'm 36 years old now like this isn't easy yeah, there's patterns to undo, new patterns to shape, and and it is it does get more challenging. The older you get, the more attached to those, those rhythms that you become, um for sure I love just the identities too, sorry.

Shelby Wagner:

16:09

Yes, identities yes, right, and having those like form who you are and then, so therefore it feels like a part of you, is like maybe falling, falling off, falling away when those change yes, definitely, definitely themes of unbecoming and shedding, as as we do in fall right nature and us right, I know, and I just I feel like we've talked about just this time of year and because we have notes on what we've been up to in the fall, it just does seem to follow that rhythm of kind of bigger things coming up in the fall that need to be addressed, that need to be let go, that need to be faced. It just seems to happen, at least for me and it seems for you as well, that there are these moments that get us looking at what's not working.

Khara Collins:

17:06

Yes, and it's so nice to have you to share it with. There are these moments that get us looking at what's not working. Yes, and it's so nice to like have you to like share it with, because it feels like I'm not alone. You know, and sometimes, a lot of times, we have similar, similar themes that come up and it's just really cool to see how it just makes you feel like a part of something bigger. When somebody else is like sharing their experience and, even though it might not be exactly the same, just those same kind of themes coming through, just that sense of belonging is like also a new, a new experience. So I'm just so appreciative of that and I I feel like we talk about it all the time, like how grateful we are for each other and our relationship, because it really is like so different to be able to like share with somebody as you're going through these things, instead of just like landing it in the journal or speaking it into the ether.

Shelby Wagner:

17:56

Right, yeah, and like you said, that, even though the the details and the specifics aren't the same, the underlying themes often are very, very, very similar. So I echo that back and that it's so nice to have somebody to share it with and like process it. And, yeah, when you speak it out loud, it helps you make meaning, I think, or at least yes, definitely, and hearing it back, like hearing yourself talk about it, it's's like a whole different level.

Shelby Wagner:

18:44

I know, and I don't know about you. When I reread those words, those emotions come with them right. My body remembers where I was, how I was feeling when those words flowed onto the paper, and so to speak them out loud again brings up those emotions, but also gives you a chance, I believe, to check in and see where you're at like. Are you in that same place? Or now do you feel beyond that, or you know just to be able to notice?

Khara Collins:

19:18

yes, that's so true. I mean, even the last episode we recorded, I was like tearing up reading. You know I didn't tear up this time with this entry, but I've been like sitting with it a lot and I have been crying like in the background not on this podcast, but definitely a lot of processing. And just another connection that I made with this was my grandpa passed away in 2019 on the same day as this miscarriage, so that was a whole nother like sad sink, but still it was just like okay, on top of this, there's also this other kind of remembered sadness that's coming up during this time.

Shelby Wagner:

20:01

Mm, hmm. And this morning, you know, I pulled a card from my, from my Oracle deck and it was the scarab beetle. I think that's how you say that. I'm not sure. And just there was a line in there about every ending has a built in new beginning, new beginning. And so for you to have these like themes of, like death and rebirth, literally and figuratively, during these times the sinks be sinking, I don't know yeah, for real.

Khara Collins:

20:35

And the other thing is like this community that I'm like starting to build is like I'm birthing something else during this time. That's like almost, really, almost exactly in time with when I found out what I was pregnant, you know. Obviously it's just beginning, so I hope it doesn't miscarry, but I think, um, I think we're off to a good start and it's like remembering to like take it slow and just like not rush through things. That's been a whole theme too is just like you know, again with the productivity and all that, just giving myself space and not feeling that pressure of like needing to be productive all the time or get xyz done for no real reason other than my own timeline.

Shelby Wagner:

21:22

You, you know, yeah, that's such a fascinating parallel that I'm just seeing. Right now, like you tending to this new community, this new birth, and approaching it in a different way, in a slower pace, in a calmer way, and what that will feel like to bring something to life in, like the calm and quiet.

Khara Collins:

21:49

Yes, and it just really parallels some of the stuff that you're going through to like navigating this unknown space with this new perspective. And I'm so excited to hear about your entry or meditation notes whatever we want to call them because it's just like, once again, the sinks be sinking.

Shelby Wagner:

22:12

Yes, yes, before we move on, I just want to recite back to you that you said my tears are more powerful than my anger, and that just feels so good, as like closed taste. I'm'm like. I just want to say it's like delicious like my mouth like waters on it, it like, just you know, I feel like for everything that's going on in the world right now, any kind of like patriarchal oppression, power and our ideas of what's powerful, whether that's weaponry, whether that's force, but just like really luxuriate in tears being more powerful than anger, I mean that's so good.

Khara Collins:

22:59

Yes, it's definitely one of those little like mini mantras I have, like I don't really get hung up on crying as much as I used to Like. I used to definitely like hide it and, like you know, try to suppress it, but now I'm I'm definitely like more allowing, just like when they come I'm like, oh good, like we're transmuting things.

Shelby Wagner:

23:22

Yeah, that's beautiful, thank you. Thank you for sharing, sharing what's on your heart with all of us. You know, like I said, I've got similar themes happening of of value, of worth, of belonging, and there are these themes that keep coming up for me, but in different places and in different ways. I almost, maybe like the universe, is like okay, let's try, let's try this angle, maybe this time you'll. You know, and I feel like I'm learning every time it comes up for me. For sure, I just find it interesting that it seems to come wrapped in different boxes each time.

Shelby Wagner:

24:04

And right now I, oddly, am battling this tooth problem and that's where I'll start this journey. That, I feel like, is something in my body. I can't explain it, but I have had this issue for over a year now, where I've had, I've gone through getting a crown, I just recently had a root canal and this tooth is still throbbing with pain, like when I I shouldn't say throbbing when I press on it it hurts. So right now I'm having to avoid chewing on it and it's a molar. And I have, you know, started to explore like, what kind of other emotional things in your body can lead to different kinds of pain in your body and so stumbled upon the German New Medicine research and where German New Medicine looks at trying to identify kind of emotional causes for physical pain, I guess is how you'd explain it. And so one night I couldn't sleep and my tooth was hurting, and so I decided you know, as you do, at 3am Google what's up with my tooth. And I was shocked when I came to this definition and this entry around this particular tooth, this molar, relating to feeling undervalued and or the inability to quote unquote bite back, that feeling of powerless or less capable than others, unable to stand up for oneself. And it went on to even say that a root canal likely involves longstanding feelings of not being good enough or being criticized and, like jaw pain in general, self-devaluation and issues around expressing oneself feeling inferior. And I was like whoa, okay, that's a lot that feels heavy and instantly, you know, running through like okay, when have I been feeling this way? What's making me feel powerless? And have I not been able to bite back? And so I'm just. I will read a little bit here of what came up for me as I was trying to sort this out.

Shelby Wagner:

26:31

I suppress anger when I have a right to be angry, but I don't want to amplify emotions already occurring. I don't want to be the target of someone else's anger. This past year, feeling powerless in some ways to my financial situation I work really hard but the money from my work seems to trickle in. I fight to resist comparing myself to others and their success and feel the negative consequences of speaking my mind at times when I call out unfairness or simply state the facts. It jeopardizes friendships, but I notice friendships that truly aren't for me, and it presses on my desire to belong, to be seen, to be heard, to be valued. And actually feeling valued is a big one.

Shelby Wagner:

27:20

Give so much, create, write, and it feels like I'm given sympathy, likes or small amounts of money. Like a street performer, the wider audience not respecting my art and my words, not seeing value or worth on what I do. I feel like a nice to have. I know I have to create and speak anyway. I can't hold back or bite back my words for fear that they're average or for fear that they'll incite anger or push people away. I know how to communicate respectfully. I can do that. I can say what I need to say. The reality is I am valued by many and it is my focus. I'm winning over others that will deplete my energy, especially those who are not meant for me. This will distract me from being who I truly am. I'll try recording my voice when I have something powerful to say. I think belonging would be a good problem to bring to breath with work.

Shelby Wagner:

28:23

I have to speak fully, without respect to money, which I believe I do it's the value piece. Will it matter if I do or don't Feeling the pull of my dreams versus moving from the push of my fears? What I heard this morning? Perhaps I need room to allow silence to hear what needs to be said, instead of reading or reacting to the inspiration of others. So this first part, what really caught me off guard once I had wrote this, was the value piece. I had never really used that word value before. I'd always talked about being seen or being heard. I wanted to be seen and I think even right now I could say I want to be heard. I want my stories to be heard, I want my you know I'm a line five heretic, like I want everyone to hear my solutions and love them. But underlying that is this sense of value and this sense of worth and I think, as a manifester impact, I'm craving that impact. I'm craving seeing that what I'm doing is making a difference. And so I took this, these thoughts, into a meditation a little bit later, thinking about how do I transmute this if this belonging and this value and wrestling with kind of trying to people please and hope that I'll be valuable. You know these unconscious behaviors of you know trying to seem worthy. How do I let go of this? Because I've I've visited this topic before. I've looked at how I have always felt like I'm like who am I to do such a thing? Or the third in a group? I'm the third party, I'm not the first and the second, I'm not the first one, chosen Like. Those are things that I brought with me from my childhood and I've looked at those, and so I brought that thought into one of the inner expeditions, the sound meditations by Vaness Henry, and in this three part meditation you're supposed to get these different treasures in each one, something that you need for where you are right now.

Shelby Wagner:

30:47

And during this meditation, I went into this courtyard and I started looking around. It was this beautiful room with plants and it was all misty and just like humid, and there was a bright skylight at the top. And while I'm looking around, I'm in this meditation and my higher self is exploring this room, this magic top hat appears and I was like, ok, this doesn't feel very like edgy relic, like the day before I'd gotten a bundle of sumac, you know. And I was like, okay, well, a hat, and so I was feeling around inside this black hat, you know, thinking that it was like a magic hat and like what's the magic? And this voice just said the magic is in you. And I just started to cry instantly and coming off, you know, these thoughts of value and belonging and thinking like how do I get it and what else do I need to do? And this voice just saying like it's you and it's inside of you, and needing to sort through, probably still really what that means for me.

Shelby Wagner:

32:03

But the beautiful ending to this meditation is that it felt so reassuring and I put the hat on and I stepped outside of this room, which was in the side of a mountain Rocky Mountain and I opened the door and I step out and I noticed that I have emerged as like a new version of myself. Like it's me, but not me. It's like a like cooler me and I have, like this long curly hair and I have short curly hair and I'm wearing this, you know, you know this new hat that I've gotten it's and I'm wearing this cute little vest and it's vintage. It looks kind of like Gangs of New York era, like the greatest showman era. I've got this vest and these like tapered pants on in this long jacket, and I just look like a badass, like just a total badass, and I call for my horse and like hop on. And I'm still just a little like who is this woman? Like she's so bold and like confident and I'm like I know this is me, but it also isn't. And so, you know, the meditation ends with me riding on this, this horse, and just feeling like so free and so alive and so excited.

Shelby Wagner:

33:31

And I end up falling asleep right away after the meditation and waking up and just being like, wow, what the hell just happened. And I was just so excited by this new, this new persona, and I was like, what is this Like? Is this who I'm evolving to be? Is this like a part of who I am that is emerging now? But it was so interesting to go from this like moment of like value and wrestling with like does anyone care? To like coming out of this meditation and really feeling like I don't really care if anyone cares, like the magic is in me and I'm a total badass and I really was so excited. I reached out to another creative manifestor who does digital artwork and I was like can you create? Can you create this thing that I have in my mind Because I feel like I need to see it and I feel like I want to bring it with me, like into my day? I need it present because she has something that I need for where I'm going. So I'll take a breath there.

Khara Collins:

34:48

I love it and it ties into your breath work that you've been doing. I just your approach to meditation is so awesome. Like you know, Vaness Henry's meditations in the first place are just like super magical. But you take it to the next level with the way you approach, with your questions or whatever the theme is, and I just love hearing your experiences and wasn't was little Shelby in this one she was in my starting point, so, like in the beginning, yes, yeah, yeah.

Khara Collins:

35:21

So I love how she shows up too and I love how this one. You know these themes of people pleasing and what it means to be valuable and you know just seeing this new version of yourself and having something to put on. You know like physical thing to put on and like transform into this person and just it's like you seeing yourself as this person and valuing yourself and knowing that you know you're worth it and this is who you are, even if it feels like really new and like how could this be? But I feel like I see this badass in you already. I'm like what?

Shelby Wagner:

35:58

is she talking about? I know it's funny, I was journaling about that. I'm like what? I feel like there's something different and I'm like, but what is it? And I really couldn't name it, like I was writing about it and I'm like, well, I think I'm bold, I think I'm courageous, I think I'm confident and I'm like. So why does she feel so different?

Shelby Wagner:

36:17

And I haven't been able to answer that question. And the answer just might be that, like, back to that head and body space, like my mind might know all of those things. Like hell, yeah, I'm this like because I'm line one and I know the things that I know. But I think there's a piece in my body that isn't totally sure about that, that doesn't totally believe that for some reason. And I think that's the to be continued for me is to see what my, what my body is remembering about my courageous, bold, confident self and to see maybe my body is holding on to times that that got me into trouble or times that that wasn't valued I'm certain there's plenty of those moments and that maybe my body doesn't feel safe being bold and courageous and confident and like effortlessly beautiful, like maybe that doesn't feel safe and I feel like, as I'm processing this out loud. That's probably very much the reason I feel like that's her, that's me, but it's not.

Khara Collins:

37:43

Wow, this is so, so good. It's like I wrote down a bunch of notes while you were talking and I'm just like. It's like you get to see yourself and see yourself believing in yourself and embodying this person. And didn't you also say that this community mosaic theme was tied into?

Shelby Wagner:

38:05

Yeah, so yeah on the well on the synchronicity front.

Khara Collins:

38:11

Sorry to jump into that, but I'm just like we got to talk about it.

Shelby Wagner:

38:14

It's a great reminder because I feel like so many things happen sometimes in like a 24 hour period that it's like how is any of this real? Yes, yeah, so Top Hat and that like the whole vintage Gangs of New York, the greatest show vibe. Vintage Gangs of New York, the greatest show vibe. Yeah, next week I'm going to be at this half day women's conference where I'm bringing my new book, the identity field guide, and I was asked to help with an art installation that can be done throughout the day and the theme of the event is inspire and the whole like mood board, is like vintage circus, like aerial aerialists and like just this empowering, like feminine vibe. And so all the people who are kind of helping with the event were asked to wear these vests. So it was pretty funny that in my meditation I like step out in this vest and this long jacket. But then also I haven't told you this.

Shelby Wagner:

39:18

So when I was younger, I did a dance routine and I told you this part where I had a top hat and it was, and then the outfit was a vest and pants. But what I didn't tell you is that this was the first time. It was a total manifesto moment. I didn't know it. I was a soloist at this point and had been dancing probably for 10 years and I told my dance teacher I wanted my, my ending performance that year, the tap dancing performance, to be acapella. I didn't want any music and never had she ever had a student perform a musical number, a dance number, without music and out of nowhere. I was like I don't know, I just want to perform this with no music. I wanted to just be acapella and the beat of my tap shoes. That's my whole dance.

Shelby Wagner:

40:13

Oh my gosh, I love it because tap dance is like its own music, like you are literally creating the music, like that's so cool, so talk about the magic is in you Talk about looking back right, and at first I was like, oh my gosh, this is like a memory from my childhood. I had this hat, that's so fun. And I was like, oh my God, that's the dance number that I totally went out on a limb and was like I'm going to do this without music and I'm just going to let my my tapping talent which I was a decent tapper I'm not sure this was going to be like an award-winning performance by any means, but my manifestor energy was like I know what I want to do and I want to do this. And so, as this just came up for me yesterday and I was like, holy shit, like this is reminding me like of what a badass I am. This is reminding me that I just I go first, I do things, whether people are going to clap or not. That is who I am.

Khara Collins:

41:13

Wow, yeah, I love it so much, this whole theme of like coming home to yourself and like remembering parts of you that are like coming up again now, like however many years later, like it's so wild, like how old were you when you were doing that tap dance?

Shelby Wagner:

41:30

I think it was in high school at that point.

Khara Collins:

41:33

Okay, yeah, I think I was like 10th or 11th grade that would be like interesting to go back and see like what the astrology was during that year, like if there's any similarities, like I mean, obviously it's coming back up. So that's really awesome and I I love like just the whole, like investigating like the not feeling safe in your body piece and just recognizing that and like giving yourself space to dig into that and what does that mean and what does it mean to feel safe in your body and kind of claim this new identity?

Shelby Wagner:

42:11

Yeah, and just really kind of having to learn real time because, you know, one day I can feel like I've got everything figured out and then the next day it's like, oh well, what is this new thing? And, like you said, what does that mean? To not feel safe in my body and oh I, my body doesn't feel as bold and courageous as my mind does. You know, I've been extremely grateful for being led to breathwork in the last couple months and going to these sessions that have been extremely empowering and transformative and I do think that is a path for me to continue and I actually think that's part of I feel like I just saw that the other day, for, like mountains, environment is breathwork Like yours is like water getting in the tub as shores. I saw like breathwork or something like that the other day and I was like okay.

Khara Collins:

43:07

Yeah, and just like manifestor, like the throat chakra, like you know just all of that.

Shelby Wagner:

43:14

But it just is really. It's really powerful for me and as someone with such an active mind, you know, even just doing these like meditations and stuff, as you always say, like the details, it does feel like a movie for me, and so to be in the breath work, it's like another way that I access like all the strong visuals, but at the same point I'm really getting into my body. And so I do believe doing some one on one work in that space is going to help me continue to untangle whatever this is that's coming up, and I'm starting to feel excited about it, Like I'm starting to. I know it will be probably challenging and there'll probably be lots of tears, but that work feels very cathartic to me. At the end of sessions I feel like I've done just like an immense workout. That feels very satisfying, and so I'm very excited and curious to continue exploring that modality as a way to access these emotions and and make make those two people feel like a sink, you know, like one.

Khara Collins:

44:21

So yeah, that's really awesome. The like timing of this breathwork community that you found that's like so close to where you live too and they have like monthly sessions, right like to be able to do that in community just feels so powerful. And you mentioned like the belonging and breathwork theme. Like that's it's just so nice to like that you have access to that like in person especially yes, yeah, definitely, definitely in person. It's right for me we really digging through it, yeah such good stuff.

Shelby Wagner:

45:00

Such good stuff do you? Have anything else to close us out.

Khara Collins:

45:05

I guess I did want to touch on your piece about your jaw and your teeth and the not being good enough and self-worth related to that, because I've experienced that too my whole life. I have like I don't know I should really know the number of root canals.

Shelby Wagner:

45:21

I have but.

Khara Collins:

45:22

I don't, it's like four or five.

Khara Collins:

45:24

So I totally relate to that and it is fascinating to see like on these different charts were through like meridians or the teeth, like what they tie to, and how like hard it hits when you realize like, oh my gosh, this is related to me valuing myself or my self-worth and what that means and how to cultivate the feeling of value and belonging.

Khara Collins:

45:49

And it's so cool that we have access to all these tools to help us like navigate this whole human experience, because it feels really extreme sometimes, but that's kind of the beauty of it. Like you have these extreme like feelings of, like sadness, but it allows you to have the other end, like extreme joy and happiness. And it's just like extreme joy and happiness and it's just like, I don't know, feeling okay with that, like knowing this is all normal, like there's I mean, there really isn't a normal, but, like you know, just accepting all of these different feelings and experiences and like integrating them and just the opportunity to like be in community with different people and, you know, heal with them is just really amazing and I'm just I'm so happy that we get to share together too. It's just, it's so cool and I'm just forever grateful that we are friends and we have this podcast and then the book club coming up. It's just everything just feels really exciting. But it's not without, like you know, some struggles and some, like you know, work it's. You know it's it's not easy all the time, right.

Shelby Wagner:

47:00

It's this balance, it's the balance and knowing how to live into the hard times and to really savor the good ones and to see what, what's there for you to learn. In some of those challenging moments I feel like I'm just collecting tools to put in my little like knapsack on my journey. Like with each thing that I move through is a new piece of wisdom, a new tool for me, the journey ahead, and to kind of just flow with it. You know there are times that feel really hard and feel really messy, but I feel like the more you recognize there's a flow to it or that a new beginning is built into every ending. They don't pull you down and suck you down, you know, and knock you off your center as much you can can come back, come back to center much easily and and keep flowing.

Khara Collins:

47:59

So yeah, so grateful. So, on brand with the Libra eclipse, and didn't you say that? So, like guess the, the beginning of this eclipse series was like last July 2023. But like you started these meditations, what month was it? October?

Shelby Wagner:

48:20

yeah, yeah, it's like another important date, I don't know for for what part of the astral season, but yeah, it's like a complete cycle year correct, coming up on a year of starting them and so much more to dig in there.

Khara Collins:

48:36

I know I just love this theme of like appreciating the growth you know, being able to look back and see how much you've grown and transformed, even through your meditation landscape. Like you know, seeing the mountain at the top, or like being at the bottom in the beginning and now, like you know, navigating to the top and stepping into this new version of yourself. It's really cool. And what awesome documentation to have. Journaling this podcast boxer.

Shelby Wagner:

49:08

That would be us looking for evidence and, I know, collect it all. That would be us looking for evidence in all the places I know, collect it all. Well, I think that's a good place to leave our listeners.

Khara Collins:

49:19

Yes, the little bow is on Right Until next time.

Shelby Wagner:

49:23

everyone, Thank you for joining us for this episode of Looking for Evidence. We hope this conversation gets you curious about the evidence showing up in your everyday life. Till next time.

This was a 6-2 Studio production. Find us at six-two.studio for all your creative sound needs.